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-   -   Pj64 vs Windows (http://forum.pj64-emu.com/showthread.php?t=66)

Anonymous 24th April 2007 08:20 PM

written by Me
 
Instead or working with no Nt Systems why don't you start working in a linux version? windows98SE, milenium, 95, they are all dead.

Anonymous 25th April 2007 12:46 AM

written by Your grasp of English < a 3rd grader
 
I think you guys should make people pass a grammar/spelling test before allowing them to post.

That said, fuck Win 98. The narcissistic bastards that want you to cater to their needs at the cost of everybody else can go fuck a pig (while admiring themselves in a mirror).

Anonymous 25th April 2007 08:45 AM

written by xiphi
 
I think only XP and Vista(x64 and x86) should be supported. Anyone running earlier versions is just asking for trouble since MS no longer supports Win2k/98/ME.

Also, for those who are confused about Vista's drm, directsound and such...

The DirectSound was removed from hardware to reduce the amount of system crashes due to bad drivers. Now all sound is rendered in software. The only way sound can be rendered through hardware is to have an OpenAL supported soundcard.

As far as DRM in Vista goes, DRM only allows you to PLAY DRM protected content. It does not prevent you from playing your current collection of movies/music/videos.

Driver support has so far proven to be good in Vista, from me and my friends experiences. The same can be said about application support. With that said, not all applications will work on Vista.

In the end, I do hope that DirectX10 can help better PJ64.

pz

Anonymous 25th April 2007 11:33 AM

written by Luppus
 
I agree with xiphi
XP is now becoming old but 98 and older versions are getting archaic
PJ64 should only be compatible with vista and XP and we're all fine

Anonymous 25th April 2007 02:21 PM

written by Sebastián
 
Well, I think that a Linux port would be excellent, but better it would be if ALL of the source code would be released. Maybe someone with some of time would port it to another platforms, and not limited to Linux only. And if to drop or not to drop Win 9x support, well my opinion is do what ever you want. By the way, from Win 9x to Vista those (can I say operating systems?) things are just crap.

Anonymous 25th April 2007 10:01 PM

written by ko
 
first i'd like to say great job on p64 and i wish the best.

if dropping 98/2k/etc support results in more resources that could make p64 better then it should happen. for the long term it's the best.

i'd hate to see supporters of older OSes whine and convince you guys to put the effort to support the older OSes because later it'll come back to haunt you when they upgrade in the future and then complain about why things don't work in Vista.

Anonymous 26th April 2007 01:06 PM

written by Jackson
 
I know we've already been told to stop talking about Linux, but I think a lot of people really would be ecstatic about a Linux version of Project 64. I'm one of them.

Anonymous 27th April 2007 07:36 PM

written by Nekurakami
 
Vista is agendaware with no substantial improvement over XP. It looks better. OOOHH! WOW! What a compelling reason to buy an unfinished, DRM-infested, broken, bloated OS for a totally unreasonable price. Windows 2000 and 98 on the other hand are legitimate operating systems that people still use. I used Windows 98 until about 2004 because I couldn't stand all the useless bullshit stuffed into XP (dog in search bar, stupid GUI, inflated start menu, unnecessary services that run by default like Portable Media Serial Number, Automatic Updates, Indexing Service, Remote Registry, PSMP, IMAPI, BITS, Error Reporting, Fast User Switching, Telnet (who even uses telnet anymore when there's ssh?), etc.).

Vista contains an inordinate amount of unnecessary BS (~10GB worth), is horribly buggy, DRM/TC-ridden, and DX10 does not support a lot of good things that DX9 did in order to more effectively enforce DRM (i.e. no more hardware accelerated audio). Vista forces you to use Microsoft's proprietary filesystems and I could go on for about a week about other reasons why I'm never in my life going to use vista. I'd rather use Fedora Core, SUSE, Windows 2000/98 or even (god forbid) ME. I'd take a bash prompt any day over an overpriced corporate agenda conglomeration with Aero slapped on top of it.

I'd very much appreciate continued support of Windows 2000/98 along with, or better yet instead of support for Vista. Vista was a failure from conception, or as the FSF has aptly said, "Defective by Design".

Thanks a lot and keep up the excellent work. On my next pay check, I'm planning on donating something in the area of $100 to this project (I'm not rich, either :-/).

Cheers, Nekurakami

Anonymous 27th April 2007 08:14 PM

written by .:b{X}s:.CQ
 
Can someone explain to me where the debate is now so I don't have to read all the post above :)

Anonymous 27th April 2007 08:47 PM

written by Nekurakami
 
I know i'm beating a dead horse and I've probably already said more than my share about this topic, but honestly more people use Linux than Vista, and Vista hasn't exactly been an astonishing success. I just don't see the reasoning behind putting hours into making PJ64 vista compatible when it's quite an inconsequential matter considering how many people actually use it and how there are more important things the time could go to (netplay, variable framerates for games, whatever). It's your project obviously and you will do with it what you want. Like ko said, if dropping 98 support will lead to more time spent on more important things, sure go for it. Oh well. Unlike ko said though, there are a whole lot of people who are utterly unimpressed by vista and have no intention of "up"grading until they are absolutely forced to. Adding vista support is a waste of time. Using vista at all is a waste of time and other resources. I did install a copy (I didn't wast money on) on a Athlon X2 5200 with a 7900GT and 1GB of DDR2-800. It still managed to run things slowly. It also took about an hour to install the 10 to 11 GB of shit I'll never use or see the justification of.
And to clarify:
Yes, I've used Vista. I'm not impressed and many people share my sentiments.
Yes I know those unnecessary services can be shut down. It's still ridiculous.

No, I'm not trashing Windows XP. It's much more stable than 98 and below and supports a lot more devices. It's all around "better". Unfortunately, if you can't even use the damn thing without constantly being accosted by asinine animated vermin and asked inane questions like "Do you want to search Windows Update for the driver?" (yeah, right) with the choices of "Not now", "Yes", and "always" (where the hell is "never"?), it becomes more of a pain to use than something that has a Christmas light effect if one program crashes.

Yes I know that the DRM in vista allows you to play DRM'd files and doesn't restrict other files. Part of the problem is that the more mainstream support DRM gets, the more incentive there is to use it.

What I'm more worried about is the Trusted Computing garbage that vista was designed from the ground up to support. My computers take orders from ME. Not some asshat in a suit at Microsoft or any other corporation or entity. While they will always try to pass it off as a way to ensure more "security", it's actually an enormous opportunity to lock out undersirable (from MS's standpoint, not yours) software.

I've said enough and gone horribly off-topic. My main point is that from all of my experience with vista and the literature I've read about it, my conclusion is that Vista is simply an operating system without any legitimate purpose. It's the obligatory new windows from Microsoft that everybody's just expected to eventually adopt. That's it. My opinion is that there are more productive things that can be done with PJ64. And as for the DX10 argument, although I'm no expert on graphics APIs, it seems to me that even DirectX 8 is overkill for N64 graphics. There's only so much you can actually do with the models, lighting and textures that are built into the game, am I right?

If adding Vista support really isn't a problem, go for it. I'd just hate to see 1.7 delayed further in the name of supporting a trash OS. Considering that there's a whole topic about support for operating systems though, I'm assuming a lot would have to go into it.


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